Category: the Rant Board
Hello just hope when i'm going to work tomorrow that i don't get a foren cab driver. or if i do get one its one that i've had before and can understand
Shame. I clicked on this board to see a nice, juicy rant. All I got was a lame one-or-two liner, and it wasnt' even properly punctuated or spelled... ugh. first-world let-downs, I tell ya.
Also, what an idiot.
I'd rather have a foreign driver than an asshole born in my country tbh.
But I guess that's why he posted this board, for people to point out how much of a fool he is and start arguing, smh.
Can't spell foreign, has to spell it f o r r e n.
Bernadetta, totally agree.
Worked too post 3.
Wonder if he speak English. The poster. Smile.
Very true, Bernadetta. I have to agree with the original poster on one thing, even if he doesn't know how to write. Foreign cab drivers are often the bane of my existence as well. They generally can't communicate worth shit as far as understanding directions or explaining anything goes. However, they can sure communicate just fine when it comes time to tell me the price, or disagree on said price, since they usually try to charge way higher than I know the fare should be. I realize this is a generalization, and that not all foreign cab drivers are the same. I've very occasionally meet a good one. Unfortunately it's been my experience that the vast majority of them are as I described above.
When ya come to our country, god damit, why the fuck don't ya fuckin' learn English, as long as I don't have to teach ya. That's somebody else's problem but I'm sure as shit gonna bitch til my brain turns blue even though it don't help shit! Damn lazy good-for-nuthin cab-drivin' job-stealin welfare-livin' forreners, they took our jobs!!!
Uber?
Lyft?
Learn lengo. It's a mix of hand movements, head shakes, and a few words. Lol
Being over charged, shake had, say no, offer correct fair in and. Driver not understand, frown, say dispatcher?
I really believe they can speak English well enough or they'd not be able to pass the test to drive a cab.
I think they use it to have fun actually. It probably gets boring driving all day.
I love the ones that ask personal questions. I ask em right back. Lol
I'm completely with the first poster, with regards to the majority of foreign cab drivers causing distress and frustration all across the board.
I'm hoping post 8 wasn't actually written to be serious.
I have issues with drivers who refuse my dog access, unless they have an exemption certificate. I don't care where they are from, and I have had problems with drivers born in, and born out of britain.
But I don't care if their english isn't very good. If someone genuinly makes an effort and is polite, even if communication is difficult then I respect them for that. Yes, it can be a little hard sometimes to communicate where you need to go, but if they work with you to figure it out, and are actually genuinly nice then i'm more than happy to assist them.
If they're rude, it really doesn't matter where they're from. I've had rude drivers who are clearly not foreign.
Oh, I was most definitely being satirical there.
Lol to post 2; I agree.
Also, I think being a fly on the window in a cab with Wayne would be too funny. lol
Godzilla has the market cornered on satire for sure. Keep it up though, it's amusing.
Also most cities now let yu use an app on your iPhone from which you can pay, as well as input the address you're going to so it shows up on their GPS.
I think I have some experience here that our North American-only friends on this site don't have: I've actually been to other countries that didn't speak English.
The reason you or anyone else who is in a foreign country knows how to deal with price first? Because that's what is taught you in foreign language classes. Same goes for people who come here. I understand people making comments probably didn't make it beyond first year in a foreign language ... but, for those that might remember ... the first things you learn are often how to count, identify objects, and yes, deal with money. Taking directions and getting an address are actually very difficult tasks in a foreign country. Truth be told, it takes a period of years being in that new country to really master a language. They can't just 'larn it' overnight. These apps are wonderful things for this.
The app I use here is Curb. It works in multiple cities.
As to Lift and Uber required to take guide dogs? City cab companies are forced to do so by local regulations only. This is why cities like Portland don't yet have licenses for Uber and Lift: To be a licensed cab company means your drivers have to pick up the elderly person with the walker or the blind person with the guide dog.
Outside of that, it's just civil laws for Uber and Lift, and it's then up to yu to sue the company. That's what civil law means: it's up to the citizen to enforce via civil, not criminal, courts.
Where it's a violation of a city ordinance, such as for licensed cab companies, then people can call the police, and cities like New York did sting operations on cab drivers at one time.
I've seen complaints all over Twitter RE: Uber and Lift and their failure to pick up dog guides. But the truth is, these are only enforced as criminal laws where the local city has licensed them as a licensed taxi service. It's part of the challenge one faces with deregulation. While I object to cities like Portland making it impossible for Uber and Lift to do business here, most people don't actually understand the laws involved, and what governs whom. Either using ADA as a catch-all, or something similar.
In point of fact, even city taxi services, the cab driver is not an employee but a purchaser. They lease the cab for a dollar amount a day, used to be $300 per day. The fare is regulated by the city, unlike Uber and Lift. But again, if you use the apps, you see the fare as is and pay from the app, taking full control of the situation yourself. They're not employees, they pay to lease the cab, and are not required under law to answer dispatch. Of course, once they do, then depending on your city's ordinance, they are required by law to take whoever comes, be they blind with a guide dog, elderly with a walker, or whoever. That's just how the cab systems work.
Then, drag systems like paratransit into it: Paratransit the driver gets half the fare (usually) as they normally would. Of course, they get - in theory - a set number of fares so they can count on these without having to "hustle" for business. And, after the fact, they can go get other rides as they wish. I don't know about Portland's system, but others I've known about do it this way. I haven't used the Portland paratransit system since the mid 90s, and then only based on where I was.
I do have to say if you're in the service industry, you need to gbe able to properly communicate. That goes for all the stereotypical foreign jobs, Cab drivers, tech support, eating establishments. You don't have to be perfect; English is a bloody difficult language, but at least have enough to cary on a conversation and understand what people are saying.
Everyone doesn't have an iPhone or tech device.
I do think all blind persons should have at least a basic cellphone since these are available.
Because Uber and Lyft and mostly private citicens, I guess it be there right not to accept a dog in their personal cars.
Yes, I know, it isn't nice, but it is their personal car, not a public taxi.
It's even more of a pain in the ass when you're hard of hearing as well.
Agreed, Blind Guardian. Most jobs have qualifications, and one qualification for the service industry, such as cab driving, should be the ability to communicate well with customers. Too bad that's not actually required.
Leo, Wayne has a point. Not everyone has a smart phone, and for those that do, apps are only available in certain areas. I know about Curb, for example, but it's not available in my area. Speaking of which, I've also used both Uber and Lyft before, and I sorely wish they were available where I live, too! I hear Uber is coming to this area soon, so we'll see. As cab companies go, the one I use is pretty good. But back to your point Leo, I do see what you're saying, and if one does have a Smart phone, and apps/services like Curb, Lyft, Uber, and so forth are available, they can dramatically cut down on the hassle that often comes with foreign cab drivers.
Oh I agree; I'm sorry but I find most foreign cab drivers extremely frustrating indeed for the simple fact of cunnication.
Also, half of them don't know where they're going, but i try and be patient. *sigh*
communication. Sorry guys; my typing is wrong.
well said, BG; couldn't agree with you more.
So the answer to you all would be a revolutionary concept: Have a company who hires cab drivers instead of leases cabs to them. If you hire someone as a W2 employee, you have the sorts of things Alicia is talking about: job descriptions, etc.
When people lease a cab, or when I owned businesses and leased buildings, the terms and conditions of the lease is all that is official.
The problem with the employee model is as the employer you now have to pay employer taxes, FICA, insurance, etc. The way systems go now, including Uber and Lift, is that the person leases the car. So you get no such sway over job descriptions, etc.
Sounds like a business model any of your bright minds could figure out, how to create an economic model that would work and provide you with what you want.
At least now you know how the cab system works, for those capable of doing something beyond rant.
P.S. Uber and lift are like the regular cab companies except for some licensing differences: Thbey use their own vehicles and so don't have to lease the cab. Also, they are not subject to city licensing.
Anyway, to get something as part of the job description, we'll have to turn cab driving into a job with an employer, instead of a business who leases the cab and uses it, subject to the local terms and licensing.
just cause that's how it's done, does not make it right.
I am wholeheartedly with those who say that if foreigners come here expecting to live here, they need to learn the language; no ifs, ands, or buts about it.
if they're unwilling to put in the effort to do that, as the majority seem to be, they should either stay where they're originally from, or put out the money to hire an interpretor, so that people who use their services don't have to be frustrated over their not knowing how to communicate effectively, due to not speaking the language that we speak here.
Let's all move to (insert country name here) and demand that the people speak and write in English. Give 'em a taste of their own medicine. Hehehe.
Wait, you mean we might actually have to find ways around communication
barriers? Cuz, and this really blows my mind, America isn't a monolithic country
of one culture and one language? Cuz, and again, mind blowing, we're kinda
designed around the idea of people being free to live the life they want? So,
you're saying that you might meet people from another country who don't
speak your language, and you have to find ways to communicate with them?
That's just awful, how can you expect to live like that? I mean, acceptance of
others? What are we, communist? We're a god fearing country, dammit. If you
want to move here and enjoy our freedoms and our escape from whatever
situation you were in back in your homeland, you'd better speak our god damn
language and believe in our god damn god and worship our god damn flag and
be just like us, or you can get out. No good, sorry, low down fucking
immigrants. They all act like our country was created by people who immigrated
here from Europe or something. No good, lazy, unamerican bastards.
You tell em, cody. Sorry people. But as a first-generation American myself, I know how damn hard it is for people to learn English. Some of my family members still havent' learned it yet and they'd been here more than twenty-five years. Yet their work ethic is spot on. They've earned every penny they worked for in this country after being dirt poor in their own. They own houses, raise kids (who know both their native language and English), and they pay taxes just as well as all of the rest of us English-speaking folks.
What in the world do some of you know about learning another language when you only speak English yourselves. You're basically saying that someone who can't speak this language for one reason or another doesn't deserve the opportunities this country has to offer. And yet, most imigrants are sincere, hard-working people who are perfectly willing to do all the dirty grunt work that Americans cant' live without but won't do themselves. All in exchange for freedom to do as they please within reason and to live in houses with actual roves over them. Right. well, we have people in this country who speak only English and still they don't speak it well, and they're not even haf as energetic or willing to do their share to contribute to society. But they deserve to be here, right? Because they speak the language. Yeah... Why don't all of you who have such an issue with foreign people in customer service roles take a long look at your family tree and see where your ancestors came from. Then we can talk.
Your all annoyed at the little bit of inconvenience that stems from having to communicate with foreigners who can't speak perfect English...Thaat's a first-world problem compared to some of what a lot of these foreigners had to go through back in their own homelands. Be grateful you can take a cab at this point as a disabled individual without someone shoving you into a bording house for disabled persons like they might do in china or even some European countries.
boo-hoo, life is hard, we all know that; that's nothing new or praise-worthy.
we all have to work hard, but we americans are not staying in other countries illegally. big difference.
and, Bernadetta, nice job you're doing of making assumptions yourself; what the hell do you know about whether or not English is our only language? even if that's the case for some people here, why does that matter?
as I said, we're not here illegally, and work hard for what we earn. most foreigners, don't; that's the cold hard truth.
also, Bernadetta, that isn't what we're basically saying; that is exactly what we're saying, let's make that clear. no "basically" about it.
English is indeed a difficult language. One need only look at our numerous and often contradictory rules to realize this. Plus often, illegally or not, people who come to North America are seeking better opportunities than exist in their country of origin. But that's neither here nor there. There are some jobs where communication is less important. But in a job in which inter-personal communication is a large component, knowing the primary language to a passible degree is extremely important. Nobody has to be an eliquent aurator, but being able to cary on a conversation, and more importantly understand what a client or customer is trying to say is very important. Both parties need to act with civility and patience when verbal communication is hindered, but it can become disconcerting and frustrating when what you're trying to say is going over someone's head. That's no excuse for either person acting like a dink, but we're all humans, prone to doing things at times without a little forethought.
Post 28 made her point very eloquently indeed.
Do you know why most cabdrivers are foreign? I'll tell you. Foreigners come to countries
such as Britain and America and are willing to do the long hours and the dirty work that
the so-called indigenous or non-immigrant communities are not willing to do. I will agree
that it is inconvenient and annoying if someone cannot communicate properly when you're
paying them for a service. I have dealt with some real arseholes over here who are
English. When I say English, I mean white, indigenous British people. I'll tell you
something else. Some of the nicest people I have ever met in this country are foreigners.
Most of the time if you go to a city such as London, the person who will come up to you
when you are taking the underground will be a foreigner. Can I help you my friend, do you
need assistance my friend. Most of the white people will completely ignore you. You
should bear that in mind before you start spouting your racist ignorant criticisms.
Chelsea, how do you know a quote-unquote foreigner is illegal? You don't
have to speak english to be a legal resident of the united states. You do,
however, have to be a racist to use words like foreigners and illegals to describe
people of other cultures. So Chelsea, do you enjoy being a racist?
agree totally with Chelsea on this whole thing.
I also believe anyone going to an English speaking country to live (such as the U.S, U.K, Australia etc) needs to learn this language, no if's no buts. I feel passionate on that subject and am in no mood to argue wihth anyone on that matter.
I wouldn't expect to go live in a non-English speaking country and not learn their language; it's damn rude at best.
I'm totally with Chelsea and Rachel on this one.
I would like to point out at this stage that there are native people of countries such as
Britain and America who can't speak the so-called native language as well as some
foreigners. Also. When a foreigner comes to a new country, they are not just going to
install some kind of app in their brain that gives them a 100% grasp of said language.
Some of you people need to live in the real fucking world! But you don't. You just want
everything to be convenient for you. Life doesn't work like that. Deal with it. I would agree
that if you go to a new country, you should attempt to learn the language and customs of
said country. Again, this is not a simple process, and cannot be achieved overnight. People
who choose to uproot themselves and their families to go and live in a new country
usually have a very good reason for doing so, Such as war, economic poverty, take your
pick.
Chelsea, your argument about legal versus illegal immigrants is totally irrelevant to this and just shows how hateful you are twoard immigrants in general. I personally don't know anyone who is illegal in this country; I did say the people I know who don't speak english pay their taxes, didn't I? Do you think illegal immigrants pay taxes?
Also, I do find it interesting that those of you who are so very against foreigners not knowing English fluently are only capable of speaking English. Am I not right? Chelsea, what else do you speak. I speak polish, english and Spanish, just so we're clear.
Rachael, any other languages? Impy?
I'm not asuming, just double checking.
Also chelsea, it's kind of funny that you say foreigners aren't willing to work hard... Have you ever scrubbed a public toilet for six bucks an hour? Ever dealt with ignorant, needy racist americans and their whiney attitudes about their first-world problems while you're trying to scrape enough money up to feed your husband and kids? Oops. Nope. I'm sorry. You're one of those americans. My bad. lol.
Excuse my bad English.
Also, do you want to know why Americans aren't staying in other countries, legally or otherwise? Because it's much harder to relocate to another country if you're an American. It's even difficult to go live in Canada if you're an Amaerican. Hmmm. Wonder why they don't want us anywhere else. lol.
No, I don't speak another language, but I'm also not going to move to another country and expect the people there to speak English for me.
Ok some people on this thread have a serious case of Operation Numbnuts.
First, if you do go to another country, you are likely to find people who do try and communicate with you. And when some of you fools actually go to another country and try to use the 3 years of high school Spanish or French or whatever in order to communicate, something tells me you're gonna learn.
I see Chelsea totally missed my entire post entirely. Contracting to lease a cab = you can't stipulate those kinds of requirements, because they are not a W2 employee, they are a partner in business. Jesus, the American education systems just makes me fuckin' sick! Really? Don't know the difference between a W2 employee and a contractor? Or in this case, a business leasing the cab?
I know this may take more than an eight-grade education to understand ... but ... when someone is here legally, that doesn't mean they're a citizen. That implies temporary or permanent residency. The temporary residency comes in many forms, from a work visa with a specific employer (not applicable, kidlets, because we're not talking about an employer here). Or you have a visa to be here for a limited number of years. Used to be 3 to 5 when I worked at immigration back in the 1980s. You can then temp to perm, get a permanent residency card. In none of these situation are you tested at all for anything. You're allowed in based on a number of factors, not the least of which is fitness to support yourself and the "lottery," where your number happens to be up at the right time to get in and fill quota for legal emigrants from your nation of origin.
The one and the only time someone gets tested, and it's a written test at that, is for citizenship.
It's really not that hard to understand, even for dropouts.
The cab company is basically a leasing agent, you may have to look that up on Wikipedia. The driver leases the cab subject to some terms and conditions including city ordinances. Sort of like when people you know rent a vehicle for the day, except of course the local ordinances surrounding cab licensing. Anyone can do it, provided they have a valid driver's license and often provided they pass a test required by the local jurisdiction.
So since some of you turdstools know so much about immigration laws and how cab companies should work, why not create a competitive service like Uber or Lift, only part of your requirements would be the driver must pass an English competency test, one of your choice? Of course, to do that, like I explained earlier, you'll probably need to have them as W2 employees, paid by the hour, instead of partnering with vehicles the way these services often work.
For you Fox News junkies, I'm not arguing for or against immigration laws here, we're just talking the practical implications of how things actually work right now. It would help to actually understand the how and the why of things, rather than just stamp one's widdle feet and demand.
We all get the communication problem. But it's not just people from other countries. It's the mentally challenged person at the grocery store who can't read for shit, and are useless to you as a blind consumer. Or the young person at the grocery store, who probably thinks textbooks are books that send texts, and equally can't read for shit, and is eqully useless to you as a blind consumer. Or the fully English speaking cab driver who can get lost just as easily. That shit's difficult.
But, I'm amazed at how many people in the U.S. are deliberately stupid about how immigration actually works. Too busy packing the fat face and watching Faux News / listening to Glenn Beck go on one of them diatribes.
Oh well, have it your way, monkey-sans.
Got to say I'm down with Leo, dale and the others with their train of thought here.
Yeah, it can be very, very frustrating when you can't communicate with someone so well, but that doesn't mean we should hate on them for that. I can't remember who it was, Dale I think, who made the point that a lot of people who come to the US and the UK are willing to do work that most people born in the country are not. Fruit picking is an example over here, cleaning jobs, things like that. People rant about being unable to find work, yet you find them a job cleaning and they kick off and become very bratty. I'm not saying all white people are like this, but it is a factor we all should consider.
So, if you want to create a company where you only employ perfect english speakers go for it, but I can guarantee you they won't stand for the long hours and low pay a lot of workers from other countries do. So then you have to raise the price of the service in question, in this case taxis. So after you do that, people look at those high prices and think fuck this I'm going somewhere else for my taxi, I can get it half the price there.
You see the problem?
How do you know, Impy? English is a required second language in Poland and other slavic countries, for example. Why? Because American, English and australian businessmen have a stik up their asses about using translators in foreign countries, and so in order for people to do business even in their own countries, they have to learn our language.
The truth is, if you haven't learned another language besides your own native tongue, you have absolutely no idea what the process entails. Not really. And I don't mean taking your prerequisite feaux spanish in high school, from a teacher who can barely speak it herself, where you are welcome to speak Spanglish till you master the language properly, which is likely never.
If you've never taken, and passed, a conversational language class, you have no idea how challenged and lost you get to be because the person teaching you plus the other students arent' allowed to help you out in English.
How many of you comfy cozy nay-sayers have traveled outside of your native country? Chelsea? Impy?
How many of you who find it so inconvenient to communicate with a foreigner ever found yourself among other foreigners and you're desperate to speak their language, but you still just can't master it.
Tell you what. Go learn french, or german or Polish... Your american tongue will break in half because you will find that you cant' quite muster the sounds and the blended silibles to make these european accents sound half-way normal.
More worldly people aren't complaining. We do admit that yes, it can be an inconvenience to have to speak to someone who's not fluent in english, that yes, sometimes its more difficult for us blind people because we also lack the eye contact that could sometimes help.
But more worldly people have had businesses, have had kids and have had to find the way to pay for their expenses, more worldly people have traveled to other countries and attempted to learn other languages, so they know just how challenging and daunting it all is. Truth is, most of you who bitch about having to deal with foreign people are probably way to chickenShit to do any of what they're doing, to travel to a foreign land and make a better life for yourself, or just to be there to experience something different.
Don't think for a second that many of these dirty, non-english-speaking foreigners who are so lazy and such an inconvenience actually want to be here. You know what dictates their move here? Opportunity for a better life for their kids, not the desire to leave home and live in a foreign land. Their need for food and for work nececitates their move, and so many are homesick, even years later, for their own language, their own customs, their own way. And those immigrants, those people who had to come here to get these opportunities were once your ancestors. They came here for your grandparents or even parents, and thanks to them, you are now likely able to speak perfect English and type it wel too, so that you can sit on your asses and bitch about your hardships. lol
And I'll say one more thing: if you want to get rid of these foreign non-english speakers, why dont' you take some of their jobs for yourselves then. This isnt' all of you, but oh, I've seen and heard some of you scoff at the idea that you go and take an imigrant-worthy job like making beds or doing laundry, washing dishes, etc. instead of sitting at home and collecting your SSI checks.
Nope; those jobs aren't for you, you're better than that. So guess what? Someone needs to do all that. And someone also has to drive your blind behinds here and there because obviously, you cant' do that yourselves either.
Foreign people become cabbies because that's an easy job to come by in America, as Leo explained. Also, they learn just enough English to get by, and they do communicate with their customers well enough, because most of their customers can see and they can rely on hand motions and eye contact to get their points across. Most foreign cab drivers don't figure that they'll get a blind fool as a customer and they dont' figure on the major of deficit in communication due to your lack of eyesight. They dont' figure on that because we are a minority. And when you have three kids to feed in Syria and there are bombs blowing up your neighbors houses, you think that maybe driving American asses around all day is probably a more tolerable ways of life and so you go and do it.
Only thing you dont' count on is that your kids kids will turn out to be another set of American snobs. lol.
Hands up. You're right. I'm sorry.
Can I also point out how fucking stupid it is to say that English is the native
language of America? First of all, there is no native language of america.
Secondly, if there were, it would probably be something like cherokee, or
seminole, or mohawk, or some tribal language you've never heard of, let alone
know how to even mumble your way through. Next, there are dozens upon
dozens of enclaves in this country in which english is not the native language.
Case in point, go to Taliquah Oklahoma, know what the native language is
there? Its Cherokee, not English. Go ahead, try to learn Cherokee. I dare you.
But lets forget the native americans for a moment. Lets take the language that
our first European settlers spoke. English all the way, right? Wrong. The first
settlers in North america, not counting Vikings, sorry vikings, were French. The
oldest continually settled European community in north america is St Augustine
Florida, a spanish settlement. So they didn't speak english either. The people
who founded the nationa of America spoke english, but they also spoke French
and Latin and sometimes even Greek. So how about you learn at least one of
the languages mentioned here before you go shooting your mouth off about
how immigrants should speak the native language.
I realize this was centered on America, sorry England, but its true of their too.
The native language of England was probably some form of celtic language, or
woden, or pict, or scot, or gaelic of some sort, I don't know. The native
language of Australia is some form of aboriginal language. English isn't any
more native to any of these countries than it is in America. So just shut up
already and stop showing us how racist and ignorant you are. Its geting old.
Yep. Thanks for throwing some true intellect into the mix, cody. I'm the queen of common sense, perhaps, but you get the cake for all the historical facts.
As for others.. well, some are humble and smart enough to stand corrected.
But others probably can't manage to get off of their high horse for long enough to eliminate their own ignorance. lol. ugh.
So unAmerican of us, eh?
hahaha
Bernadetta, love the "eh" that you threw in there. :)
I think anyone worth their salt should learn at least one foreign language. The whole
experience of learning at least one other language educates as to the complexities
someone faces in conversing unnaturally and perhaps builds a little empathy towards non
English speakers who relocate to an English speaking country.
It never ceases to amaze me how ethnocentric Americans are. I hate to generalize, there
are some lovely and decent American folks, but your reputation globally is of arrogance
and intolerance. It is too bad that this is the case, but when almost everyone in Europe
feels they need to know English to participate. in today's global economy, it is bowing to
the pressure placed on them to bend to the american way. Besides perhaps China, would
an American businessman ever have a reason to have to learn the language of his foreign
contact country? I think not.
I echo that I have seen all over Europe, that immigrants and foreigners do take all the
dirty or harder jobs that second or later generation residents will not even consider
taking. That happens here in Canada, the States, everywhere. Some people just aren't in
a position to be choosers when poverty is the way it is, or war threatens.
In any case, let's just try to make the most of a situation. If you have a problem
communicating with someone, try harder. If you have a problem with a habitual inability
to converse, instead of choosing to complain, why don't you get off your behind and lobby
the boards or government authorities in charge to change licensing requirements, or place
other conditions, on prospective cab drivers, instead of flapping your gums about it.
Good night.
Or, just so I can be a bit more proactive in this, if you have frequent run ins
with cab drivers who cannot understand you, there are countless apps for smart
phones that will translate text into a bunch of different languages. Get one, type
in what you want to say, translate it, and show the driver. Not hard if you took
the time to think about it for a couple seconds.
Here's another tidbit:
Those of us who can speak other languages have an easier time figuring out what a foreigner is saying, even if we don't speak their particular language.
Here's another thidbit. Anyone else realize that the more ethnocentric a person is, the more ignorant and inexperienced as well? Just something to ponder...
Well, I really don't want you blind people taking over the cab drivers jobs. I'll take the non speaking English drivers thank you.
I'm an idiot in some of you all's minds, but Bernadetta is smart for assuming that English is my only language? how does that work? answer: not at all.
Bernadetta, contrary to your idiotic assumption, I do speak another language fluently, not to mention, my last name is not representative of my skin color.
no foreigner has to come here, as many people claim they do.
most foreigners say they wanna come here under the guise of having a better life, yet, they constantly complain about "us damn americans," the policies we have, etc...and that's what some of you call nice, greatful people? if it is, I personally want nothing to do with it.
I forgot to add that I've also been to another country, several times throughout my life, in fact.
however, that's completely erelivant to the discussion here.
clearly, many people are emotionally invested in this subject and therefore they've convinced themselves that those of us who are very passionate about our opposite feelings than the majority of you have, must only speak one language, and therefore, we don't have any concept of what the "real world" is like.
for one thing, I likely wouldn't travel to a country of which I was unable to speak the language. or, if I did decide to do so, I'd make sure that I was well prepared ahead of time.
aside from people being here illegally, which is a problem in itself, another piece to the puzzle is that so many americans fall for the sob stories that so many foreigners tell.
many americans believe the stories they're told, without ever thinking rationally, as imp, Rachael, and I have clearly learned to do.
Since when is hatred and ethnocentrism rational thought?
And notice how chelsea fails to name that other language and country.
Ummm. and what's the rant about the last name and skin color anyway? Chelsea, sweetie, do I know your last name? Nope. Do I know your skin color... um. Let me think.. Uh Uh. Nope. Neither ever factored into my arguments and explanations. Ever. So let's stop grasping at straws here and tell us more about how worldly you are. You are making a terrible botch of convincing us otherwise, as it stands.
for the record, Bernadetta, I've been to Mexico several times throughout my life, and I speak fluent Spanish.
also, I learned to speak that language before taking those high school courses you and others have tried to use in your arguments.
I even took an advanced conversational Spanish course, when I was attending college, so I actually do know what I'm talking about.
so, I and others who feel as I do are not saying that foreigners are never deserving of the opportunities America has to offer.
what we're saying, is that, if they don't obtain a green card, and they choose to be here illegally, then, they don't deserve anything we offer here.
if, indeed, they truly wanna be here, then, they shouldn't hesitate to go through the process of obtaining their green card, period.
Except that it can take several years to get a green card Chelsea, so you don't
know if that cab driver just passed their immigration test the day before. It is
incredibly hard to get citizenship in America because of people like you who
don't want so-called foreigners here. People have been calling for lessing the
difficulty of the tests and applications for decades, and the republicans keep
blocking it on the backs of bigoted racists such as yourself.
The funny thing is that the vast majority of people who are natural born
citizens can't even pass the immigration test. You can take it for free Chelsea.
Why not go and try your hand at it. Lets see how good of an american you
really are.
Chelsea... I'm shaking my head. Get off the drugs dear; you're starting to convince me you might be related to Amanda Bines in the mental confusion department...
Because please, tell me, what the hell does speaking English have to do with getting a green card.
First you rant about foreigners who dont' know how to speak english.
Then you prattle on about illegal immigrants.
Then you go on to last names and skin color.
Now you're talking about green cards and going back to illegal aliens?
Oh, goodness... and all that after Leo took painstaking measures to try and explain immigration to you all...
Here's some news. You know my Pollish relatives? You know, the ones I talk about throughout this thread, the ones who don't speak english yet they work and pay taxes? They, uh, all, have green cards. my mother is a naturalized citizen.. And though she speaks ok english, a person like you would have a problem with her because of her thick accent and because sometimes it's hard to communicate with her in, uh, your native tongue.
Look. Maybe a ton of the people you know crossed the border to do nothing but mooch off the government illegally, but if you're talking about a certain demographic and a certain culture, you're verry limited.
And you went to Mexico? That's nice. Might as well have stayed in texas for all that foreign experience brought you. Try going to a European country, try setting foot in Asia, or even travel to Egypt or somewhere a little more foreign than the country where the United State's secondary language is its primary language. Then maybe your multicultural experience will hold some clout.
Thanks Bernadetta and Cody. Cody brought up a lot of the historical. I admit I got sidetracked into both the business end of doing cabs and the immigration process. Bernadetta's right: no such luck, your green card is not based on passing any tests at all.
Anyone who doesn't want to use an app to speak to the person in their own language, consider the following as an alternative:
Use your notes app, write what you have to say, just one or two sentences, and show it to the cab driver. I guarantee you, people can read and write nonnative languages way better than they can speak them. I used to translate for the federal government decades ago. But I don't speak Spanish all the time anymore. Almost never, in fact. So I can still get by, but I can easily read Spanish news articles online, or Spanish literature.
I have never used one of those apps which speaks to the other party, I just need to actually sit down and practice with one and see how it goes. But I've written an address down and showed my phone to the driver. Or written down the name of a landmark.
To anyone who has not spoken a second language, trust me: reading it is the easiest, second to that writing it, and third listening to it, and last of all, speaking it.
That means, in reverse order:
You can understand a hell of a lot more than you can speak. You can read and understand a hell of a lot more than you can write to express yourself.
And again, the stuff you're taught first are things like money, numbers, letters, colors, etc.
Know what else? Getting and giving directions is a bitch in a foreign language. You can do it in language drills all day long in class, but when you're standing out in the rain in a country not your own trying to get or give directions it's a whole new ball game. Worse than that are if the directions have to change midstream or if you run into obstructions along the way.
There's a reason I got lost in an underground subway system for a couple hours in Japan once.
Oh, and if you've ever been tired in your own country, you've never been tired until you are in a country that doesn't speak your language. The mental energy it takes to self-maintain and communicate in a nonnative language is staggering. Then, after you are worn down and find it more difficult being tired, it takes even more energy just to keep up.
It's all true, and it's amazing how we never think of it when we travel. But it happens every time.
So true Leo, so true. I got lost with a group of friends in downtown Hanoi last
year. I've never been more confused in my life.
As long as they're polite and can communicate reasonably well I don't care where tey're from.
Bernadetta, the reason I went all over the place, is cause questions were asked of me by a few people, which I answered, clearly in a way you and others didn't like, but I answered the questions that were posed to me, nonetheless.
first, Bernadetta, you assumed that I only spoke one language, which I told you wasn't the case.
you couldn't accept that though, and you wanted to know what the other language was that I spoke. so, when I said that I spoke Spanish, you felt the need to criticize my answer, cause it wasn't the precious Pollish that you speak, or whatever else you'd use to justify saying the things you do.
the reason I brought skin color into this, Bernadetta, is cause, again, I wanted to show you that I'm not a dumb little white girl who doesn't know what she's talking about.
however, you again attacked what I've put forth, cause that seems to be all you know how to do, when you don't agree with whatever differing views are being presented by someone else.
you also asked why I brought up getting a green card, and that's because leo asked myself and others who share my views what solution we would pose, and that's the solution I posed.
of course getting a green card is a process; so is having to wait on insurance approval for medical treatment, but you know what? it's what has to be done if I, or anyone else, for that matter, wants to receive the medical care we need. welcome to the way the real world works.
Bryan P, the point you brought up, is exactly what I've been trying to get across here, which is that, if people cannot communicate well enough to provide the services for others that they've committed to providing, such as driving a cab, as we've been talking about here, then, they should not be in that business.
so, next time, Bernadetta and others, either don't ask me questions, so I have nothing to answer, or better yet, learn to accept differences of opinion, cause not everyone in the world sees this issue the way many of you here do.
So, by that logic, most doctors shouldn't be in their line of work because they
can't communicate what's wrong with you exactly? Sure, they give you a highly
simplified version, but that's it. Its impossible for them to communicate the true
nature of your disease. Good logic you've got their Chelsea.
my doctors all speak English (I wouldn't go to a doctor that I couldn't understand), so Cody's attempt at an argument doesn't apply to what I said.
also, something that I meant to say earlier, is that it is not the responsibility of the passenger in a cab to use an app on their iPhone to communicate with the foreign cab driver.
it's the cab driver's responsibility to communicate with their passenger, if and when they need to do so. they're in the service industry, and as was said above, it's a damn shame that speaking clear, understandable English, isn't a requirement for their service industry-related job.
Why the hell is it not your responsibility to communicate with someone via an app or whatever have you, regardless of what language the other person speaks?
I mean, after all, you're trying to get from point a to point b, right? Aren't you going to try and be resourceful regardless of the fact that someone is driving your behind their and you're paying for it?
The only kind of person who would say that they shouldn't have to utilize other sources to be able to communicate with someone else, whether it be a foreigner or someone else with a multitude of circumstances preventing them from communicating in a straightforward way, is someone who is either not smart enough or not resourceful enough to do so.
Leo does it without bawking, and last I heard, he's American.
I did state before that the cab drivers mostly take in sighted passengers who can communicate through a mix of hand signals and eye contact; you're the blind passenger that the cabby isnt' expecting. Why should he make exceptions for you and go out of his way to communicate with you if we go by your own logic. Why should he care whether you can communicate with him, because quite honestly, for every blind person like yourself waiting to be driven by a cab, there are about twenty sighted people who will happily take your place and who will be less challenging as a customer for the cabby.
Trust me, the foreign cabbies want to deal with you about as much as you want to deal with them most likely. They just want to go to work , get their shift done and get home. And you're posing a challenge for them that they likely don't want to contend with.
Especially not if you don't feel like being resourceful and meeting them half way, and instead you're much more interested in adopting your narrow-minded entitled American's point of view.
Chelsea, more than half of this country speaks spanish. Even if you only spoke spanish, you'd be totaly fine because nearly every place of business will accomodate you...by law. Spanish is our secondary language. So there's little wonder why I dismissed your claim to know another language. And again, that white-girl/skin-color argument is totally out of place here, because guess what? I'm a white girl. Only difference between that stereotypical little white girl that you speak of in your post is that I'm not dumb and I do know what I'm talking about. You, on the other hand, still don't, in spite of how fervently you argue your point and play the victim of attack. lol.
I have no problem with you having an oppinion chelsea. I will call you out on it though, if your oppinion is based on ignorance and lack of research. Just because you feel a certain way and because you feel strongly about it doesnt' justify your idea as correct, well-informed and practical. You're angry at people attacking you, with what? whith facts? with experience? With a reality check? lol.
I'm only mirroring your own attitude in this discussion; so if you think it's harsh, you might want to look at your own stance here. You might also want to do a little fact-checking before you start spouting things that sound good to you. lol.
Chelsea, you didn't say people who spoke clearly, you said people who can't
communicate. So a person who isn't good at public speaking, or who is shy, or
who doesn't have a wide enough vocabulary would fall into that category. You
should choose your words more carefully.
and I have to side with Bernadetta here. Chelsea, you live in Texas, speaking
spanish is not an accomplishment. speaking manderan would be an
accomplishment.
But in Texas Spanish will get her far with cabbies.
I also have said we need to use signs, or other things. These really work.
In a cab, you are basically doing a few things.
Where are you going? Addresses are numbers and a Street name. If you drive you understand this.
Speak slowly, say the numbers, 3912, than you have a direction maybe, West, South, North, or whatever, say that.
Spell the street name if need be, because even American's don't pronounce these correctly, or may not know how it is suppose to be said, nor spelled.
It is your responsibility to have some idea of where you are going, and if you don’t, you must rely on the dispatcher if you and the driver can’t communicate.
Now, you’ve got money. You are either charged the correct fare, or if you feel it’s not, and you can’t settle the amount, again, the dispatcher will cover this.
I’ve notice cab companies are suggesting to riders now to make sure the GPS units are on in the cars so they get the best service. I heard this just the other day when I called to get a ride.
If you are equipped with a smartphone, install the company app, because it will monitor you trip.
This wasn’t available, but is now.
I for one am glad form people take these jobs. When I want to go, I have less wait time, due to more drivers being available.
I jump in, give my address if I’ve not done so when I order, and sit back.
It is my responsibility to have an idea what the trip might cost, because it is my money we are talking about, and I don’t like over paying for services.
So I think we the passenger have just as much responsibility as the driver to make the transaction go smoothly.
Concur with most here.
And when it comes to the government, Chelsea says it's not the service provider's responsibility but the customer getting blind services. And when it's a cab, it's not the customer's responsibility? Doublethink much?
And hell, even up here in Oregon Spanish is the most common second language. All the daughter's school broadcast emails were sent out in English, Spanish and a couple other languages.
Oh, and visiting another country with family is far tdifferent from actually having to live there and conduct business.
But don't let reason and rationality get in the way.
I completely agree with Leo, that traveling with friends and family is totally different to having to conduct business or live somewhere. I've been to a lot of countries, and I've never had to deal with a language barrier really. But, I'm going to spain in january, to actually live and study there for 6 months. I speak very little Spanish, I'm trying to improve it before I go but I'm still going to struggle a lot.
I hope that people will try and feel a little empathy when communicating with me, as I would do to them if they were in England.
Yes, in an ideal world people would all be able to communicate easily with one another, but that just doesn't happen. It can be frustrating, and difficult, but it's like that for both parties. Instead of bashing people can't we try and understand where they might be coming from? There's a reason why they're in the US, the UK, whatever country. You might not agree with it, but why make your, and their life any more difficult by not using the resources available to you?
If you could use a translation app, or gps and it would make things easier for you why not do it? Just to prove a point about foreign workers. That seems quite childish to me.
why is it not mine, or anyone else's responsibility to make sure the cab driver communicates effectively with us? perhaps because, as I've said in other posts, the cab driver is the one who is in the service industry; I'm not, and neither are most other people.
I've heard all you guys's arguments before though; we'll talk when you can actually think logically, and for yourselves, but I have as much hope in that happening, as I do in what Obama is doing for this country. lol.
When did you start watching Fox News, Chelsea, and what has it done to your brain. lol.
All things are bigger in Texas, they say, except brains. Lol secede already.
You got that right.
Dear god, the ignorance of chelsea's post is astounding. And to think we
actually fought a war for that territory. I wonder if Mexico would be willing to
take it back. We can make them a square deal. We'll keep everything New
Mexico west. They can have texas, and we'll stop calling tacos mexican food.
Think they'll go for it? Or hell, they want to be their own country so badly, I say
we let them.
Call it Texico.
I've always watched all news outlets, not just a particular one, which is probably what you all do, I'm sure.
The cab drivers can communicate.
The problem is mainly all the different speech patterns and slang and whatever in America.
To drive, you've got to be able to read signs, and pass a drivers text. That means you understand enough English to get by.
If he or she is pretending they aren't understanding, the dispatcher will make them. Seems easy to me.
Oh no chelsea; I don't watch any news channels. I get my news online from various sources. But sometimes, when I'm in the mood for a little commedy, I turn on fox news. For a while it depresses me, but I always get in a good laugh or two. :)
I usually check out Faux News to see what many of the septagenarians and octagenarians are being fed. Online for news plus a bit of skeptical search for sources has turned out the great equalizer.
And we see a major rise in independent / unaffiliated among the voting populace as a result.
coming at this from the perspective of someone who is actually currently experiencing what it's like to be an immigrant, i just have to say, that a lot of you are displaying some seriously ignorant and often racist views.
How many of you actually know, first hand, what it's like to move to a new country? How many of you have been refugees, like a huge number of foreign cab drivers are?
I am lucky enough that I moved to Sweden, because Sweden believes very deeply in the idea of actually assisting new immigrants to get used to the new surroundings and new language. Our Swedish classes are among the best integration classes for refugees and immigrants
in the world.
compared to what Australia, and many other countries in the rest of the world offer, those who move to Sweden are very lucky.
I have friends who are refugees, and the only way we can communicate is through the Swedish language that we're all trying to learn. If you would just stop and think for a second, what some of these people have been through, maybe you would stop agonising over your first world problems for 2 seconds and think of someone else.
integration programs, particularly in countries that do not have a policy of providing immigrants with the best chance possible, regardless of cost, are poor, and leave the new arivals with only the most basic knowledge of something that is supposed to be their new language. In Sweden, the government recognises that the integration process takes years, and provide classes for that time free of charge.
So, the fact that your country might be giving people visas to escape their shitty lives really means bugger all if they don't back it up with the integration process.
I'm shocked that a lot of you are just resorting to complaining and abusing, without bypassing thinking.
Ah yes, Feaux News. LOL.